I hear you. I’m only referring to my general use case. A 11.5 gives you a ton in a small sized package,more than a 10.5/10.3.
It’s just a preference thing for me. If I need to shoot confidently at 300 yards, knowing I’ll still get rifle like terminal ballistics , I can with a 11.5. as soon as velocity drops below 2200 you lose the cavitation. Who is shooting guns that short at that range? Practically no one, but I like the idea of having a pistol that I can load full of 65 grain M855 and know it will do what I need it to. I have no suppressor, so I don’t see the point of 10.5/10.3.
For defense use, 11.5 seems perfect for me.
If I’m shooting over 100 yards, I don’t really want to do it with a AR-15 anyway. More of a PDW type of set-up with the right ammo and magazines is my preference.
I literally had no idea such small differences had such an impact. I do have a 10.5 AR but it is not something I really take to range often. I prefer full length AR15A2 type. I take it is the rifling?
Definitely, that’s the labor pain of wisdom, things went completely to pot and they have a few times.
Any young man I meet now who is talking about guns and wants advice, the first thing I want to know is what career or education he is pursuing, next, the car he drives and if he maintains it, and the next is where he lives.
If you work at a McDonald’s, you drive a 1998 Chevy Corsica you never changed the oil in, and you rent a room in a house with your buddies, any gun is probably the wrong gun for you!
I don’t know how many times I splurged on having the coolest gun, and throwing it in a the trunk of a car that was worth less money than the gun itself.
All foolish mistakes, I’ve made so many with money that I’m a encyclopedia of what not to do.
I won’t be buying any guns soon, I plan to keep what I have, but that’s probably it for right now. And probably about 20 years from now too…
Well the rifling will effect your accuracy and stability of a projectile a ton. Failing to get at least 2 rotations before the bullet exits the muzzle means that you are not likely to stabilize the bullet well and it shows up at long distance, especially beyond 100 yards. So to say a 11.5 is much better than a 10.5 just isn’t the entire story, neither barrel will rotate both projectiles 2 times assuming a standard 1:7-1:9 twist.
Lethality is the main reason to choose a 11.5 over 10.5, the 5.56 isn’t a super effecient cartridge, so barrel length effects the feet per second achieved greatly.
A 14.5 is about on the same level ballistically than a 11.5. the difference is the two rotations of a bullet achieved by the 1:7 twist in a 14" barrel will most likely give you better accuracy. If you want to be able to shoot 300, you’ll probably do it slightly better with a 14.5.(more precise id bet) the good news is, minute of man is all I really need from a PDW type set up. And according to what I can find, the 11.5 barrels are more rigid because they are shorter, they will probably resist barrel droop better when fired allot. Also, the accuracy difference is negligible from most accounts.
So I’ll take either a 11.5 with M855 green tip, or a 18" SPR set up, with 55 grain hollow points all day every day. I don’t care what the fad is for 13.7/14.5 etc etc. nope, zero reason from a practical standpoint.
Wow thanks for answering, that is really interesting. When I bought my Grendel, I was like man what length, and I figured 3 twists in a 1:8 for such a fast bullet (relative) might be good. Was not sure, but the damn thing is too heavy for more than stationary hunting or even shooting. At least for me, 24 inch heavy barrel is not carbine!
But I have only sighted it in so far at 50 yards and the group was so close was crazy. They were less than half inch with Bipod.
The Grendel is so interesting, of all the new ammunition in the last 10-15 years, 6.5 Grendel interests me the most. I really want to build a mini-scout rifle. Ruger American ranch , in 6.5 would be a great starting point.
I’ll have to check it out. The scout rifle was a great concept, many people though haven’t made it to the specs Jeff Cooper called for originally. So “mini scout” I think is a better term.
The difference for “my” mini scout is the use of a
Inexpensive but accurate rack grade rifle, preferably with a detachable mag,
Next is that the rifle be a youth type firearm. They are lighter and smaller, meant for children or women mainly in .243, 6.5 Grendel, etc.
This way you get short barrel, short length of pull, light weight, and a caliber that is much more suited to big game animals, with more power than 5.56.
Because scout mounts are expensive, and not available for many rifles, my spec would include a red dot and magnifier, a LPVO, or a prismatic.
Last is barrel threading for muzzle devices and a sling
So it isn’t exactly a scout, but it’s a scout that anyone can likely set up for cheap, that will do practically everything a traditional scout can do.
This is my Shuff’s Mini-G bush rifle / scout rifle that I had made out of a Sept of 1942 WWII Springfield Armory M1 Garand. It is still in the original hard hitting .30-06. It has a variable 2-7x32mm Burris long eye relief scope. It is tons of fun to shoot at least with the suppressor. Without the suppressor and a 16.5 inch barrel it sounds like M114 155mm Howitzer going off. You definitely feel the concussion from the round firing all around you. With the variable magnification you can dial down for miltiple targets or dial up for longer ranges. She is one of my favorite rifles all around. 8 rounds in a clip. Easy and quick reloads this battle rifle has earned it’s place in history as one of the all time best firearms for the period and arguably a viable battle rifle even now.
wow. thats a neat m1 garand you have there being so short looks like what they call a “tanker” and the suppressor on it is even cooler. nice setup… and i usually dont like any “sporterized” military surplus rifles. my 2 m1 garands are in original configuration. and ill keep them that way… if i ever find one in bad shape, or in a sporterized configuration that i can pick up, i may try to replicate that build you have there sir.
This M1 Garand had been Arsenal Rebuilt at least one time so it was a parts mix Springfield Armory M1. Even though it is a WWII Garand the collectability of it has been affected so it didn’t hurt my feelings having it modified and made more usable in todays age. It does have some National Match parts to it that I added into the build for a little extra accuracy. The barrel had a worn muzzle so cutting it down took care of the muzzle erosion and I had a target crown put on the cut down barrel. It is more accurate now in this configuration than it was when I got it as a full size M1 Garand. With my Saker 7.62 suppressor on it it is the exact same length as a full sized M1Garand. She really is a blast to shoot.
oh i bet so Greg. it sure looks good. both my springfields are cmp rearsenals… so while not all matching parts, 1 is wwII era and the other is korean war era. mixmaster parts for both yeah, but its basically what the gi’s would have had in WWII and korea as they are, so im happy enough with them. being all correct parts would be nice but at the same time i think i like the fact that the USGIs would have them all mixed up anyways.
yet another of your fine items i can only wish i had sir… well done yet again!
That’s such a cool build. No clue why I didn’t see it until just now.
For military rifles with stripper clip feeding, a scout build is pretty much perfect for getting all the capability out of century (or near it) technology.
I had a Russian SKS that I unfortunately sold like 15 years ago. I had planned on putting on a scout type mount, and a fixed 20 round mag.
More of a mini scout than a true scout rifle like a gun site scout or your M1, but still a great way to set up a rifle that uses stripper clips.
i was going to put a scout scope on my mosin 91/30 years and years ago. I even went so far as to replace the rear sight with a picatinny rail to mount the scope to it. i never got around to it, as i branched out into other mil surps and other guns in general. now im glad i didnt, and i keep meaning to get time to work on it to put the rear sight back on the gun. I will one of these days.
I hear you, in retrospect, I know the guy who bought it off me was delighted to have a all matching numbered laminated stocked Russian SKS that had no bubba smithing done to it. I have met a few people over the years who had 91/30s and bought all sorts of crap for them only to be disappointed. Years later everyone laughs at these builds, and cringes as trends change.
Now that I’m older and a little wiser, I’ll just buy a Ruger American Ranch and put a micro prism on it if I want a light, inexpensive and capable little carbine.
yeah i dont blame him for beign thrilled he had a nonbubbad russian sks… those are rare… and even rarer being its a russian… they’re hard to find usually. I have my Yugo SKS still and its all original… great shooting rifle, alot of fun too. i always thought the russians may have invented the sks, but the yugos perfected it, cause its a heavier build, feels more solid, looks cooler, has a blade bayonet, and built in/on grenade launcher with a tritium night sights for the gun… how can you go wrong for that in 1966? at least that is what mine has and when it was built. I feel the same about the AK47. Although i’ve got to admit, i’ve never held or shot a milled truly russian ak47. my milled yugo m70a is amazing as far as an ak goes… it just has something about its look, and how it shoots that just is so… idk… good i guess.
yeah well its like when you first get into anything and you dont have the money to really get into what you want but your trying to make due with what you got… 10 years down the road when you have actually gotten what you want you look back and see some of those decisions earlier on what you had maybe werent so good… lol.
